RAC for Women

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
Regards,
*** *** ***

We have cancelled her membership as of Nov.17,and we will not refund the $which are the only payments which we have received in accordance with the terms of her contract. The member did not follow proper termination procedure according to the terms of her contract (attached) in
section titled Automatic Renewal Program and as a compromise we could have charged her another payment on Nov.15, based on notification date requirements, instead we simply cancelled her membership

This response is from General Manager *** *** of the Perinton RAC for Women as I informed him about this complaint:
I have been talking to her right along. She was very upset and combative in my first interactions with her, I had to tell her that I was not
going
to talk to her any further that day and I would gladly call her back on
Monday to give her time to cool down and for me to talk to *** / ***.
She then hrs later came into the club to talk to the manager face to
face. She didn't realize it would be me and that I was the one who renewed
her. (She did get the copy of the yellow agreement.) Even though
she was rude I still followed through and followed up on Monday and offered her
the month option which she said she was happy with She did ask last
night for it to be reduced further to months which I said was as far as we
were going. We had met her half way and it was more than reasonable
As for the classes, the phrase NO Pain No Gain has been
used for a long time by athletes and fitness professionals. I am not even
sure if it was used. If it was (and it probably was) it is meant to
motivate. Like pain is weakness leaving the body or sweat is my fat
crying…
The class she is saying form is not correct is off. The
instructor has correct form and is demonstrating it properly but as members
try, it some are doing it incorrectly she does the best she can to
go around the class correct or re-demonstrate so they can get it right. I
would also like to point out that these movements are with little to no weight
so that the probability of injury is low and that once it is corrected will
benefit the member
To summarize:
The Member had days to cancel this contract; this is spelled out in the additional terms on the back of her agreement; it is also a New York State lawWe are confident our CERTIFIED INSTRUCTORS are teaching classes properlyThe RAC for Women was more than fair by reducing this membership from to months

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below
This experience over the past month with RAC for Women has been extremely emotionally stressful and exhausting for meI have never been treated so poorly by a business beforeI have been disregarded and brushed asideDue to this, I do not want to do business with this establishment any longer; I refuse to even work out there again since I am so unhappy with how I have been treatedTherefore, offering me a month of membership and access to the service that I was originally denied for is an unsatisfactory counter-offerI would also like to note that in the reply message the RAC for Women responded with, they exaggerated my claim in saying that there was "failure to contact over the course of weeks." In my original complaint I never stated that they failed to contact me over the course of weeksI rather stated that "they failed to contact me several times over the course of three weeks," meaning that they failed to contact me several times when they stated they wouldOne example of this case was when I originally left my name and number on February 23, 2015, and I was failed to be contacted; I rather had to contact them three days later regarding the issueA second example of this case was when *** told me on Monday, March 2, 2015, that he would get back to me regarding a refundTo this day I still have yet to hear back from him regarding this issue. As a recompense, I will not request a refund of membership duesHowever, I would like to have my membership terminated immediately as a member with no cancellation fees or other miscellaneous chargesThis is to signify that it is worth more to me to no longer do business with this establishment, rather than to receive money. Thank you for your time.
Best Regards,
*** ***

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below
I did not deny that I signed a contractI could not find my copy of the contract so I called to speak to someone asking when my membership expired and if it renewed itself automatically as I did not wish to renew itI never claimed I was told I could cancel it over the phoneI was told that my membership expired in January and that it would not automatically renewI was told that I did not need to do anything furtherThis was obviously not the caseI was given incorrect Information by an employee that cost me $I do not think it is ethical to make a customer pay for an employee’s mistake
Regards,
*** *** ***

This Member is well aware of the requirements for Medical cancellation and she has not met themShe will not be cancelled until she does..Account Notes:July , 01:PM
Action: No Actionreceived medical cxl gave *** for approval denied again no significant disablity no limitations sent conf *** *** *** ** *** *** *** ** Newark, NY July 13, Dear Member: We are in receipt of your request for cancellation of your membership due to medical reasonsBased on information provided by your doctor, there is no significant physical disability or physical limitationsYour request does not meet the requirements for cancellation due to the terms of your membership agreementAs per the date of your request, we will put your membership time on freezeWhen you are ready to resume the membership, the amount of time you were on freeze will be added to your expiration dateYour monthly membership dues will continue while your account is on freezeIf different payment arrangements need to be made, please contact me

We are sorry Ms*** is unhappy with her Membership after numerous attempts to accommodate herIn the spirit of cooperation The RAC for Women has cancelled this contract, there will be no further billingIn addition, I have entered a year complimentary membership in the system for Ms***
to use at her convenienceHer new Membership key tag will be sent to the Perinton club and will be effective immediately
I have investigated the claims made by Ms*** and the response is below:
This response is from the General Manager of the RAC for Women Perinton:
I spoke with *** *** on 11/5/after she was referred to *** *** had me call *** since it was a new member issue and he had already stated the policy to her the first time she called*** after talking to me showed up to her appointment that night with *** *** who told me that night that she did not bring up cancelling again at all
*** called trying to cancel her membershipI made several attempts to try to appease the member and offer alternatives to help her get in the club again and have a more positive experienceListed below is a summary of the conversation that we had, but *** wasn’t really looking for a resolution she just wanted to cancel her contract which is not within our policy
During my conversation with *** in the morning before her training appointment she expressed dissatisfaction with not being placed with the same trainer after he initial appointment*** set up her second appointment with a different trainer because she would not be able to train her at the time she wanted twice per week for another week or so and wanted the member to get off to a fast startWhen I told her that working with *** *** *** *** or *** *** would make it easier to get in training sessions multiple times per week she did not want thisShe then asked again to cancel her contract because she was dissatisfied with the training servicesAt that point since until that day she had only used session I consulted with *** and we agreed to offer her a downgrade to a Facilities membership that does not include training and that us as well as *** would be there to help her out if she ever needed assistanceShe once again had no interest in doing this, and wanted to know under what circumstances we cancel membershipsI explained per her agreement with the club that it would be cancelled if she relocated more than miles away or if a doctor deemed her unfit for exercise for a period in excess of monthsShe explained that she thought this was ridiculous and that “we are health club, she should be able to cancel whenever she wants.” She then asked what she needed to pay in order to be done with the program, I told her the total amount remaining on the account and immediately said after, “you can do that, but we would much rather try to get you back in here and working out towards your goals,” and that even if she paid that we would still allow her to use the club up until her expirationShe said she just wanted to cancel and then told me that she was moving to MassachusettsI gave her the Fitness First site and told her she would have to complete the relocation formShe asked what that included; I told her $and two proofs of her new addressShe then said that she was moving home and she would have no proof of change of addressI asked her if she had any cell phone bills, notice from current employer or housing that she was leaving, drivers license, US Postal change of address; she then got really upset and said it was unheard of that she should have to prove that she was movingI told her that our policy makes sure we treat everyone fairly and that most banks, housing complexes, etc are usually pretty helpful as far as providing documentation of moves and that it would probably be fairly easy to secure themShe said ok and that she would get proof of her new address*** showed up to her appointment on 11/with *** *** said she was engaged during the session asking questions and that she did not bring up cancellation at allI attempted to try and catch up with *** after an appointment but I had a tour come in around the same time
*** then called me back the next day saying that she was not going to get the proofs of address change, that she thought it was ridiculous that she had to get them; but she knows she signed a contract will pay it but would not be renewing afterI told her that there is no automatic renewal of her membership and that at that point she would have to re-sign in order for it to continueI asked her one more time if there was anything we could do to help her in the club, she said no, and asked to cancel the training appointments that she had set up the day before

The Member has signed a month contract that has a balance of $and runs through The RAC for Women has made a reasonable accommodation to this Member's complaint, even though we have statements from the Fitness Coach and the Manager that we never agreed to such an arrangementWe feel this is clearly an attempt to break her contractThe RAC for Women has no intention of cancelling this agreement, as we have made a reasonable attempt to accommodate this Member

Our Playroom Policy is that we do not allow members to be in the playroom unless they are the parent or legal guardian and they only have access to the playroom for the purpose of dropping off or picking up their child *** *** prior to calling on April 11, has not had any
contact with the club or business office since June 1, and has not checked in since November 2, 2015. Her current signed contract dated May 1, is valid through June, 1, with a current balance owing of $through end of term (copy attached). Per the terms and conditions of her contract the lack of use and the fact that she joined a second gym does not negate her payment obligation under the contract In the spirit of compromise the RAC for Women Perinton is willing to offer her a one-time buyout of $to cancel the balance of her agreement. If she is willing to accept the buyout please have her contact Michelle at the business office ###-###-#### to process the payment and cancellation of her agreement within the next business days!

The Member joined on March StShe was never told she won a Free Membership; She won a Certificate which lowered her monthly dues from $to $and covered her $Enrollment feeI have attached the Member's signed contract and her Method of Payment which clearly indicates this is
a month ContractThe Member was aware of this as evidenced by her signature on both of these items as well as her providing a new method of payment on I have included a copy of this as well as the notes from her account which reflect no problems with this membership until June when the Member claims she ran into financial difficultyThe RAC for Women is willing to offer this Member several options in order to help her out of this situationOption #1- We can change this to a month plan for her Expiring March 21,2016Option #2- We can provide training and program design as her injury is easy to work aroundOption #3- She can buyout the contract for $

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me. I would like someone to contact me from their office to make sure this offer is honered
Regards,
*** ***

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me. Revdex.com spoke to consumer and the following was relayed:I accept their offer of $I want to pay using my credit cardRevdex.com informed consumer that they must contact business to make arrangements
Regards,
*** ***

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have mailed in the corresponding forms.
Regards,
[redacted]

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.  I do have additional feedback for the business, which I have included below: I appreciate the response from the RAC for Women, as well as
the kind and apologetic phone call that I received from [redacted] (the General
Manager at the Pittsford Club). As I told [redacted] when I spoke with him on the
phone, I appreciate his offer of a free three month gym membership.
Unfortunately, I am not interested in joining this gym as a result of my
experience which prompted this complaint. My purpose in filing this complaint
was to ensure that other consumers would not be misled in the same way that I
was. Therefore, I think that your suggestion to retrain the Fitness Coaches in
Pittsford for how the Bridal Show Certificates work is an appropriate way to
address my concerns.I was disheartened to read [redacted]’s response to my concerns. If
you refer back to the initial complaint that I filed, when I told [redacted] in
person that I was specifically told by her over the phone that the membership
would be free, she said that she remembered talking to me on the phone and she
did not deny that she had told me this. I think that this is very telling.  Of course, it makes sense that she would deny
her statements once the Revdex.com and the president of her company
were notified of what I experienced. I do not necessarily fault her for wanting
to protect herself and her employment status; however I do not think that this
email should have been forwarded to me.[redacted] stated in her reply that her time is valuable. My time
is valuable as well. I already belong to a gym that is within walking distance
from my house, and Pittsford is not a convenient location for me. The only
reason why I agreed to spend my time taking a tour of the RAC in Pittsford is
because I had specifically asked [redacted] over the phone to clarify that I had won
a free, one year gym membership. I am not looking for any financial incentives
from reporting my concern, and I have now invested a total of approximately 3
hours between touring the gym, receiving a sales pitch about joining the gym,
and documenting what I experienced.If you are interested in further consumer feedback, in the
future, I would suggest that you do not attach a response such as the response
that [redacted] provided to a customer complaint. Everyone else that I have
communicated with handled my concerns very appropriately and professionally. As
a consumer with a complaint, I did not appreciate reading [redacted]’s response
saying that my experience “never happened”, that her “time is valuable”, and
that she didn't want to waste her valuable time. Her response did not include
an apology or an acknowledgement that there seemed to have been a misunderstanding
between us.  Thank you for your attention to my concerns.
Regards, [redacted]

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below. I provided a landlord statement as well as proof of employment of my significant other. I was told over the phone that these were two valid forms I could send in as proof that I am living out of NYS. I am unemployed and moving to follow my significant other's job. This was explained over the phone, and I was told to send in his proof of employment. I did so, and yet am being told on the contrary that this is not proof. Also, attached to this is a picture of proof of address as something was mailed to me at the out of state address I am living at. Thank you.
Regards,
[redacted]

We are trying to be as fair as possible in this situation; it is clear from the notes (see below) the Member is trying to use all means necessary not to honor her contract: We originally offered her a buyout of $250 on a contract that had over $500 remaining on it. In the interest of compromise, We will, make a Final Offer and allow the Member to buyout for $100; otherwise we will pursue the full value of the contract.June 04 , 2015 01:38 PM Action: No Action c/i wants to cxl for financial cannot cxl xfrd to credit VM to see about financial arrangement June 05 , 2015 11:57 AM Action: No Action tt mem who expalined, didnt realize she couldnt cxl contract, thought it was just $25 a month and she could cancel if she wanted. she lives over 30 minutes from the club and her car cannot make the drive anymore. will look into options with gary From: BAC/RAC Credit [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, June 05, 2015 1:12 PM To: 'Gary' Subject: kayla Allen P35286 Mem called in to cxl because of distance from club as well as financial reasons. Lives in Newark and joined 4/25/15. Mem said she thought it was a month to month agreement she would be able to cxl because she just wanted to try it out. Said she loves the facility but she cannot afford it and her car is having problems making the 40 minute drive. Owes 523.95 total, buyout? June 08 , 2015 11:40 AM Action: No Action mem called back and said there is no way that she can afford the buyout, said she doesnt think it is fsair because she wasnt aware she signed a 24 month contract, explained copy of contract was given for her to read over. mem asked if she could cancel for medical has tendonitous. emailed med cxl form. advised $25.00 cxl July 09 , 2015 01:59 PM Action: No Action received medical cxl gave Gary for approval denied again no significant disablity no limitations sent conf Kayla Allen 123 E. Miller Ave Apt #1 Newark, NY 14513 July 13, 2015 Dear Member: We are in receipt of your request for cancellation of your membership due to medical reasons. Based on information provided by your doctor, there is no significant physical disability or physical limitations. Your request does not meet the requirements for cancellation due to the terms of your membership agreement. As per the date of your request, we will put your membership time on freeze. When you are ready to resume the membership, the amount of time you were on freeze will be added to your expiration date. Your monthly membership dues will continue while your account is on freeze. If different payment arrangements need to be made, please contact me.

The Rac for Women appreciates the opportunity to respond to our Member's complaints of "multiple services that were not provided" and failure to contact over the course of 3 weeks. In reading the complaint the only service that appears to be an issue is use of the Spin Room during non-class times....

This issue arose for the 1st time on 2.23.15 and our Manager responded on 3.2.15; while not timely, it certainly was not 3 weeks. We have received statements from our GM and his assistant outlining their attempts to address this Member's concerns, as well as the Fitness Coach who denies making any such promise for use of the Spin Room during non-class times. In the spirit of compromise the Rac for Women has decided to make an exception and make the Spin room available to this Member during non-class times. The details will be worked out with the General Manager of this club after acceptance of this offer. We will make our Aerobic Director available to train the Member on proper use and then she will be free to use the room and equipment at her convenience. I have attached a copy of the Member's check-ins showing regular usage through 2.17.15 (shortly before this became an issue). The Rac for Women is willing to add 1 month Membership time to the Member's account as a courtesy for time lost during this dispute. The Member's request for a refund and cancellation of this Contract has been reviewed and denied as the Rac for Women has not breached this contract in any way.

The RAC for Women disagrees with the Member's claim that she was mislead about our cancellation policy. This policy is clearly outlined in the Membership Agreement, which she was able to read BEFORE she signed, and given a copy of afterwards. If she disagree and wanted to cancel she just needed to...

notify us within 3 days as is NY State Law.
Here is the cancellation language from her signed contract:
"I hereby agree to buy a membership from you and I agree to pay you in accordance with the terms of this agreement. I further agree to use your
facilities in accordance with the terms printed below and on the back of this agreement. I further understand that the front and back of this agreement
is the entire agreement between us and there is no other membership agreement or any kind, oral or written which will be binding upon you. My
failure to use my membership or programs does not relieve me from my obligation to pay the Club".
ADDITIONAL TERMS

1. CONSUMER’S RIGHTS TO CANCELLATION: I MAY CANCEL THIS CONTRACT WITHOUT ANY PENALTY OR FURTHER OBLIGATION WITHIN (3) DAYS FROM THE DATE YOU RECEIVE THIS CONTRACT FROM CLUB. Notice of cancellation shall be in writing subscribed by the Member and mailed by registered or certified United States mail to the Club at the address specified in such form. Such notice shall be accompanied by the contract forms, membership cards and any other documents or evidence of membership previously delivered to Member. All moneys paid pursuant to such contract shall be refunded within fifteen business days of receipt on such notice of cancellation. If the Member has executed any credit or loan agreements to apply for all or part of health club services, any such negotiable instrument executed by the Member shall also be returned within fifteen days.
2. ADDITIONAL RIGHTS TO CANCELLATION:
I may also cancel this contract for any of the following reasons. If upon a doctor’s order, I cannot physically receive the services because of significant physical disability for a period in excess of six months. If I die, my estate shall be relieved of any further obligation for payment under the contract not due and owing as of the date of death. If I move my residence more than twenty-five miles from any health club operated by Club. If the services cease to be offered as stated in the contract, all moneys paid pursuant to such contract canceled for the reasons contained in this subdivision shall be refunded within fifteen days of receipt of such notice of cancellation; provided however that the Club may retain the non-refundable initiation fee stated on the face of the Agreement, a non-refundable $25 fee for the administrative expense of processing the cancellation, and the portion of the total price representing the services used or completed, and further provided that the Club may demand the reasonable cost of goods and services which the Member has consumed or wishes to retain after cancellation of the contract. In no instance shall the Club demand more than the full contract price from the Member. If the Member has executed any credit or loan agreement to pay for all or part of health club services, any such negotiable instrument executed by the Member shall also be returned within fifteen days. The Club may require reasonable evidence for a cancellation pursuant to provisions the above".
We spell everything out in writing and clearly state there are NO ORAL CONTRACTS, just for situations like this.
We believe there may have been confusion on the right to cancel for Medical or Relocation with a $25 payment. We do not have a cancel anytime Membership or there would be no reason to have a contract.
We have offered the Member a buy-out of this contract. The buy-out price was $150 + the $80 balance owed on her Fit for Life (Personal Training Sessions) = $230.00 Total.
The balance of her agreement is currently $768.90 and the buyout offered is less than 1/3 of her balance.

Attached is the contract that was signed on November 07, 2016 by Ms [redacted]. The contract term is for one year with an automatic renewal  clause on page 1 initialed by Ms [redacted].  Per the Additional Terms on page 2 of the contract Section 5. Additional Rights to Cancel -...

the member's cancellation rights are clearly outlined. The commuting distance form her home to the Pitttsford club (7.1 miles from her home)  is approximately 1.9 miles further than she previously commuted to the Perinton club (5.1 miles from her home).  Per the complaint we do not deem this as a viable cancellation request in accordance  with the Additional Terms section 5 clause.She is under a valid contract for the original 12 month term that she signed and she is under a financial obligation to continue payments on the contract through November 7, 2017.  We have cancelled her automatic renewal option at the end of the original term.

The member received a copy of the contract on January 18, 2017 and it was sent to the email provided as per the attached document "Copy of Contract Emailed 1.18.2017".  Also attached is a copy of the actual contract previously sent in our first response which clearly shows the Automatic Renewal Program terms and conditions and how to cancel which clearly has her signature.We have already allowed her to cancel her membership without adhering to the normal cancellation policy as per the contract.  If we would have followed standard policy she would also be charged for her February 16, 2018 dues $19.95.  Jillian has already issued a chargeback on her credit card for the January 16, 2018 dues of $19.95 which was part of the original 12 month term agreement and does not relate to the automatic renewal program.  We have also attached email correspondence attached stating the last payment date and that her contract will be cancelled.This member is now a collection account and we will not be issuing any refund.